Unfiltered Tub pond

Discussion in 'Ponds' started by TankMaster, Aug 6, 2010.

  1. TankMaster

    TankMaster Apistogramma Nerd

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    I started this very same thread on another forum. Seems like the idea was new and exciting. It was published in a newsletter and has been a hot topic ever since. If the international hobbyists loved the idea then I'm certain you guys will love it too.

    Here's the post that started it all....

    It's basically a container transformed into a pond. It is however Non-filtered and non heated.

    I ran this setup for 4 months with 5 mollies. I ended up with 50+ juveniles and adults at the end of the warm season. I gave away every single fish before I had a problem on my hands.

    Has anyone tried this yet or planned to?

    WARNING:

    • WATER CHANGES ARE ESSENTIAL OR YOU WILL HAVE GREEN WATER IN NO TIME AT ALL.

    • ONLY USE THIS SETUP IN THE WARM SEASONS OF SPRING AND SUMMER.

    • DON'T TRY THIS WITH COMETS OR GOLDFISH. THEY MIGHT JUMP OUT OF THE WATER.

    • USE ONLY SUITABLE LIVE BEARERS OR COLD TOLERANT FISH LIKE BETTAS.

    • DON'T TRY BREEDING - THIS SETUP INCREASES BREEDING RATES DRAMATICALLY! UNLESS YOU HAVE BUYERS FOR YOUR FISH, STAY AWAY!
    ADDING PREDATORY FISH LIKE TIGER BARBS MAY CONTROL POPULATION.
     
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  3. f-fish

    f-fish Well Known Member

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    Yeah - tub breeding works ... well I find that having a lower depth to surface ratio makes for a nice setup that does not need filtration. I've just torn down my green water tank - was basically guppies in 7 moths old rain water that stood in the sun outside during December - when it started getting cold I brought the container indoors and added a heater and light to keep the green water going. Made the mistake of adding potted plants and moss to the setup - something happened after a month of adding the plants that turned the once peaceful green water tub into a foul monster. So yes you can breed in almost any container - but you do not get to see the fish from the side view - BTW never did a water change on the tank only did top-ups - AFAIK never lost a fish (i.e. saw a crops).

    Later F
     
  4. Khalid

    Khalid Loricariidae

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    I am doing it with a 100l container for several years outside (summer winter) with goldfish. I had no jumpers but problems with rats, birds and dragonflies.
    I do water changes once a week thats it, works great.
     
  5. Ferryman

    Ferryman Active Member

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    im itching to try it with a 1.2m i have outside, but i cant frekkit, lol, i cant afford a 4th tank. I will resist mts!
     
  6. PeterWest

    PeterWest Active Member

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    excuse the question but what is mts?
     
  7. Vis

    Vis Gerhard

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    MTS = Multiple tank sindrome
     
  8. Oscar

    Oscar Active Member

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    You all mad

    To breed live breeders all you need fish is filter and a tank.
    I now someone who bred more than 100 platies form 25 platie that were living in his garage with a whole lot of other fish that didn't have there heaters on like his Malawi's and all he had in each tank was a sponge filter and a standard tube light and the fish are all healthy.

    Oh and he built the tanks himself.
     
  9. mydummyname

    mydummyname Balala shark

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    Ok so you guys saying you put guppies or whatever in a plastic drum outside, no heater, no filter. Just weekly water changes and they breed? Do you even feed them?
     
  10. TankMaster

    TankMaster Apistogramma Nerd

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    Sometimes a water change comes from the sky if you have an overflow hole in the side of the drum.

    Feeding is seldom since guppies, mollies and platy eat microscopic creatures in the water.

    No filter, No heater . . . .

    fishCrazy has his 1000lt flow bin with guppies. I had the pleasure of seeing it today in his backyard.

    If your water is good enough you will soon have mozzies laying eggs and eventually larvae will wriggle around which guppies will eat.

    Can you guess how many guppies you can fit in a 1000lt flow bin :)?
     
  11. Oscar

    Oscar Active Member

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    Were do you get a 1000lt flow bin

    Hi just wanted to know were you get such a big container. :heeeelllllooooo:
     
  12. TankMaster

    TankMaster Apistogramma Nerd

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    I'm trying to look for a 1000lt flow bin myself. My oranda goldfish will love the space. Might put some guppies in just for the sake of mosquito eating.

    I've contacted a few people from JHB and CPT who manufacture these things. I will receive replies soon, most probably tomorrow, and let you guys know where you can get it.

    Nice alternative to a full scale pond.
     
  13. Firefly

    Firefly Pleco

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    Could one use an old cast iron bath?
     
  14. SalmonAfrica

    SalmonAfrica The Bat

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    I think it's a bad idea. Bad fishkeeping, really.

    Sure, the fish will survive, but you're not providing ideal conditions at all. As a fishkeeper, you'll want to provide optimal conditions, not just what might work and the fish just tolerate it.

    Leaving water unfiltered is one thing, but saying that you can leave water changes to overflows provided by rain is just irresponisble. Rain is never going to fall on schedule. In fact, rain can be very scarce. Beyond that, the rain that falls in South Africa is DIRTY, especially for the first few minutes. So on top of having nitrates building up to unacceptable levels, you'll be getting all sorts of junk going in there. And to futher add to that, you're not even going to do water changes to at least take that junk out?

    Essentially, you're making a giant, stagnant bucket. Congratulations.
     
  15. Firefly

    Firefly Pleco

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    Is that directed at me or everyone in general. I would put a filter on it and have some goldfish only. Basically a small pond like any other. Maintained the same way.
     
  16. SalmonAfrica

    SalmonAfrica The Bat

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    Nope.

    I'm sorry if it seemed like an attack on anyone, but I am really against this idea of just keeping fish in a bucket, with zero maintainece.
     
  17. Firefly

    Firefly Pleco

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    No problem. I also agree with the "zero maintenance" but would it be a bad idea if it were treated like a pond and maintained like a pond?
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2010
  18. f-fish

    f-fish Well Known Member

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    "zero maintainece" could be the end result but I do not think that is the initial recipe.

    I'll take my green water tub as an example ...

    1) Started as a water change
    2) Sun and week passed
    3) added 3 guppies to solve a mosquito problem
    4) removed 3 guppies a week later - wanting to use the green water for betta fry
    5) rain, weeks go by noticed that something is swimming in thank .. see loads of guppies
    6) Temperature drops - move tub indoors, add heater and light to sustain green water - (at this point the water seems fine - fish are happy no bad smell when you stir the water etc)
    7) Months go by - no issues - I add plants and cause an imbalance
    8) Remove fish (loads of them) ... not more green water tank :-(

    I attribute the water quality to a very high surface area and a low water depth ..

    Not sure this will work with a 1mx1mx1m flow bin - but that only time will tell.

    Now allowing people to keep goldfish any anything smaller that a 300l tank - that is bad fish keeping ;-) so on the one hand I agree that this could be a bad idea - on the other monitor it and take the correct steps to fix it if need be.

    Later Ferdie
     
  19. TankMaster

    TankMaster Apistogramma Nerd

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    How can it be bad fish keeping
    if the fish placed in this setups breed like rabbits? Even guppies wont breed if the conditions are not right. Fry wont survive either. This proves that they like where they are. If you don't trust me then put a male betta in and if he builds a bubble nest (which he will) then all is well.:p

    irresponisble? I think you meant irresponsible....

    Calling it irresponsible is really a question of ignorance toward this topic. Most of the fish keepers I speak for have their tubs in immaculate condition.

    The statement about the rain thing meant: Sometimes a water change will happen with rain. I did not say rely solely on rain for a water change...:blink1:

    Besides that....rain can be good if you are in the right area (like me).

    Nobody said that there will be an absence of water changes.....:bigsmile:

    Read the very first post in this thread!!!!! . . . . .20% water changes everyday...


    I don't know where the Idea of "zero maintenance" came about really.....:huh:


    So your whole argument was meaningless because you missed the boat....

    [​IMG]

    IMPORTANT

    Not everybody has 'roomy' space in their residences to dig out a 10000L pond or space to put big tanks in. Some may have this privilege but still keep these tub setups...

    It may not appeal to you but to others out there, its the only thing close to a pond that they have. Don't spoil it for them (us)...

    Regards

    TM

    EDIT:

    Hey, didn't notice your post...

    I think it's a bit bigger than 1mx1mx1m . . .more like 1,4mX2mX1m (Depth X length X height)

    The bigger the containment the slower the water quality degrades. So I think it's true. You can have clear water if you cover it up from the sun and use an anti-algae chemical...

    My goldfish are currently small enough but big enough not to be in a small 40L. I do accept this comment as motivation to get MTS :) bbbbbuuuut .... I'm investing in the flowbin for my orandas.... I do realize space for them is important. I really need at least 2 flowbins.

    I forgot to mention that African Cichlids lived in this setup....so no point in calling it a bad idea..

    Regards
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2010
  20. SalmonAfrica

    SalmonAfrica The Bat

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    You're using breeding as a measure of fish health? Guppies - like pretty much any other livebearer - will breed in the most vile conditions. I once had swordtails given to me that were found in a puddle on a construction site, roughly 10cm and breeding, and the water was silted up with dust to the point of nearly zero visibilty. The fact that they were alive was a miracle. But that's beside the point - the conditions weren't optimal. And yet they bred. If you can justify yourself by saying that because they're breeding, they're happy, I'm sorry, you're guilty of animal abuse. When you bring that fish (or dog, rabbit, whatever) home, you're taking on the responsibility of the life of that animal, to do your best to make sure it recieves the best care you can provide until the day it dies.

    Male bettas build bubble nests all the time. You should be familar with the way some people keep male bettas in small glass jars. The males lie there listless, yet still build bubble nests. They're happy, right?

    Most? What happened to the rest?

    I live in Durban, too. You have industry to the north and south. And enough pollution in between too. The rain can be good... but rarely is.


    True, I may have misread/missed out some info. Still, it's not a bad idea, just not well thought through.

    My main issue here is that you're advocating keeping the fish in less-than-optimal conditions, which is something that people like me and this forum are working against. I've worked at a pet store before, and getting people on to the right track is hard work.

    Please consider what I'm saying.
     
  21. TankMaster

    TankMaster Apistogramma Nerd

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    When bettas are happy they make a bubble bath!Their foam can be as high as 3cm from the surface of the water.

    Those little bubbles you see are just bubbles...not a nest...

    Most of the fish keepers who I've spoken to or seen pics of have good tubs. The rest? ....I haven't seen pics of tubs here or spoken to anyone here yet...

    Less than optimal conditions? Might as well place them in the wild then...

    One of the users who posted here has done this for several years...and you say it's not well thought through?

    Anyway....

    Your argument is not substantial. Before tanks and filters, people built ponds....bred koi and goldfish and these are now the most common pond species...

    They set the tone for fish keeping...we adopted it!
     
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