Rams

Hi guys,

I had about 6 rams in my 90l tank and wanted to start a discus tank but can't get the pH down so I decided to make it a community tank with all the tank mates for Rams.
I dropped the temp. from 29 to 26???
I added in 2 small oscars to get them bigger for the big tank?
Why did 5 of my rams die???:amazed:

 

How big was the Oscars and how Big was the Rams.
They are not really compatable.
Chances are that the Oscars killed the Rams.

 

Did you acclimate them by trickling them first or did you just dump them in?
What is your current PH?

Temperature should have been 28 but I will leave this point to those who kept them in anything below!!!

What other tank mates do you have?

How long has this tank been set up and running?

TM

 

The oscars and rams are the same size about 5cm. The tank is running now for about 3 months and the rams were the first to be in the tank.
Other tank mates are a 10cm zigzag eel, 5 silver tips and then the oscars?
My current pH is about 7.5 to 7.8?

 

This could be the cause.

I am guessing you have white tip tetras and not the white tip shark

Basically all your other fish are removed from the equation except for the Oscar. They might have put too much stress on the Rams but since they are also 5cm, this might not be the case.

Did you notice any 'Hide in the back of the tank' behavior they died?

It all boils down to how you introduce the fish

PH 7,5??? Wich type of Ram did you keep ?

6.5 - 7.0 is acceptable.

Lets hear what the others say

TM

 

My Rams live very happy at 25C and show breeding behaviour all the time.
Your PH is very high for rams.
Did you drop the temp about a 1C day over a few days or all at once?

 

They lived happily in the high pH, they started dying when I put the oscars in and dropped the temp.
They always hide at the back of the tank behind the plants?
And no I dropped about 3c per day??
Thanks for the help

 

Hi. Rivulatus, its quite possible that you introduced some pathogen when you added the Oscars. This could have killed the Rams. Also remember that Rams are very delicate and "soft" fish. Keeping them at low temps, hard water etc. will just eventually cause them to die like this. Rams, though most commercially sold specimens are tank bred, come from very hot, crystal clear water. Testing their water in the wild has shown that its almost Distilled water that they live in. Bad housing conditions lead to untimely death.

 

I really never knew that about rams. They might just be more demanding than Discus? Just curious, can Discus and Rams live together?

TM

 

Hi TM. Rams are 1 of the few species of fish you can keep with Discus without it being uncomfortable for either species. I recently read an article in which the water in the Wild in some of the pools where Rams are found were tested with a Conductivity meter. Now to put this into perspective tap water will test at +-250uS when tested. RO water will test between 10uS and 20uS. Wild Ram water tested at just over 10uS in some areas. Prof. Dirk showed me a photo once of these ponds and the clarity of the water is unbelievable! You see straight to the bottom, incredibly clear water! Rams are of course prone to Ich and whenever your tank temp drops 2'C or more, they get it! Sucks! But to me they are amazing little creatures! Regards, Marco

 

What I find amazing about the Rams is that I can actually keep them alive. I can't keep any apistogramma's (sunburst etc) alive. I think my water may be too hard. And yet people say Rams are more difficult to keep... and if you can successfully raise a Ram fry, then you can start considering Discus.

I find it interesting that you say 7.5 pH is too high for Rams. At the moment Roodepoort water is coming out the tap at 8.4!! After aging, it's at about 7.9. Did a WC the other day, following day--- Ram eggs! (Community tank... so all chowed).

Oh... and it's Bolivean Rams I got

 

Hi Zoom. There is a slight difference between Bolivian and German Rams. Bolivian's being hardier and less demanding. Also, we must remember that tank bred specimens are less demanding than Wild caught one's. Nowadays we dont need such perfect water for these species to keep them happy. I agree with you also on Rams and Discus. Whenever someone wants to start keep Discus I would suggest to start with Rams. Keep them happy and alive for a year and you can try your hand at Discus. Interestingly, and this is contrary to most other fish species, Wild caught Rams can live up to 4 - 4 & 1/2 years while tank bred specimens hardly ever reach 3 years. O, and Zoom, you know enough that you wont take this up wrong - ph 7.5 is high but less important than other parameters like hardness and quality of the water. That with Rams, likewise Discus is more important. Regards, Marco

 

I raised Discus fry, does that qualify me enough to get Rams and Apistos?

TM

 

Hi TM. Good one! We should not dwell on this too much. Its interesting enough, but not nescessary or applicable to tank bred fish. So unless you want to keep Wild Rams/Discus, all this tight control on parameters are not nescessary. So you can relax! Regards, Marco

 

Hahaha, that's what I do. If you treat your Discus like an egg, they will die. If you just let them be fish, they will end up being very rewarding to keep.

TM

 

We have now completely hijacked this thread. Just be carefull with Discus though. . . They can and are tricky fish that will demand much from its keeper. They can seem perfect today and tomorrow be black, slimey and dead a week later. Never underestimate their demands, they are not the King's without reason. Regards, Marco