New shops and how we are being ripped off

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Zoom, Jul 26, 2009.

  1. Zoom

    Zoom Retired Moderator

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    My wife and I decided to visit a Hatchery in our area that actually supplies a lot of pet stores in our area... and it was a very beneficial, and a very interesting outing!

    The hatchery is called Fish Fantasy World, and is a wholesaler of tropical fish. Derek, the owner, was superb in giving us a wealth of information, and tips. It was also interesting talking to him with regards to the LFS in and around the Roodepoort area.Derek also manufactures fish tanks. He takes personal pride in all his tanks, and we saw his workmanship... it really was superb. A standard 4 foot tank will only take a 3 foot globe, (I did not know this). He manufactures all his tanks slightly bigger to accomodate the correct globe, meaning he will make a 4 foot tank to fit a 4 foot globe.
    His prices on his tanks are also so cheap, that you actually think he is using an inferior product, or taking short cuts. (He told us about a sale he actually LOST because he was too cheap!)

    Anyway, Derek has set up a REALLY small pet store in Garden World, and over the next few weeks, he is planning on expanding. I HIGHLY recommend his stock if anyone is interested. I have NEVER seen such healthy tanks, such clean water, and such amazingly healthy stock!!

    In Constantia a new store has opened called "Nemo's". The store looks great. Stock is a little low... but the manager said his tanks aren't 100% cycled according to his supplyer, and they don't want to overstock. He is also selling Derek's tanks!! (I believe Derek is actually his supplier too... because the fish looked just as healthy.

    My wife and I also popped into Life style this afternoon, and they have also just enlarged their pet section, and have included a larger fish section. Stock also looked low, but I assume this is also because they are reasonably new. (I also noticed all their custom built tanks were from Derek- he has a very definate character to his cabinets etc).

    NOW do you guys and gals wanna hear something scary!!! You know that Angel fish that you paid R29 to R49.00 the other day?? Well, inside news from the breeder is that angels are one of the easiest to breed in a hatchery, and as such, a lot of hatcheries have a LOT of Angels to sell to LFS's. Do you know the MAXIMUM that a LFS will pay for that Angel you bought... R1-00. YES, ONE RAND. The Danios that you pay about R19-00 for, hatcheries are wholesaling at R0.45c to R0.90.

    It was a VERY interesting outing!
     
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  3. Zafgak

    Zafgak Old fart

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    Hi Zoom - I think someone was not telling the whole truth - or was maybe exaggerated the truth a little to bring a point home.

    We breed angels and yes when all your water parameters and such are fine they are relativley easy to breed. Your MAXIMUM an LFS will pay seems WAY out unless that uis just in Jhb. We sell for a lot higher than that to the wholesaler who then marks up and sells to the LFS, so it sounds to me someone in Jhb is ripping someone off.

    The Norm for a medium angel is about 7-10 rand to wholesale and then 15-20 to the LFs who ten sells on at 30-40 rand.

    Above also depends on type and quality of angels.
     
  4. OP
    Zoom

    Zoom Retired Moderator

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    I am pretty sure you are right. But even at initial cost of 7 rand to jump to 40 seems a bit steep... even with normal mark up prices that are exercised.

    I think if we all started supporting the breeders more than the LFS we would find better stock, better help, and better results! I know a lot of breeders don't generally deal with the public, but the few that I have met don't have a problem selling a few odd fish to the public... I would even pay DOUBLE wholesale price to the breeder. I'd make a saving, and breeder would make double profit.
     
  5. veegal

    veegal

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    This is true Zoom but for a breeder to get rid of in excess of 300 of one type of fish every two weeks or so, just selling to the public, is not always possible - if ever. I think the problem in South Africa is the huge markups - often set at 100% or more (but not always). Understandably the LFS has to cover costs such as exorbitant rentals, staff salaries, water, electricity etc etc. I would rather make a smaller profit and shift more products than make a large profit and shift fewer products. But then again, I am fortunate in that I don't have the large overheads which LFS's have.
     
  6. stormbringer101

    stormbringer101 ARO

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    you hit the nail on the head there zoom . Ive been supporting ffw for a while now and the reason i always will is not that his prices are so low but that when you talk to derek , he doesnt try upsell anything,will give you great advice FREE even if its not what you wanna hear good or bad ,and you always drive away from there with bags of healthy fish and you know you are not the only one who is so fish crazy ....
     
  7. Slojo

    Slojo

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    Please pm me the details and conract number for this DEREK.
    Would really like to visit him .
     
  8. f-fish

    f-fish #unspecified

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    I like FFW - Derek (I think I will classify him as a LFB - Local Fish Breeder) has built a custom tank for me - and I have several of his standard size tanks .. got another 2 ft this afternoon, playing a bit. I have bought in excess of 30 plants from him, but he needs to get new stock, once the shop is extended I am sure he will.

    I'll swing by Nemo's - saw the sign missed the entrance. The LFS @ lifestyle is improving all the time - they have only been selling for less than a month. Some stock local - and other I think direct imports. Marine should come online soon.

    What I am missing is a decent supply of quality plants ... most LFS's seem to have the same old stuff.

    Talking about easy to breed and being ripped-off at the LFS ... Convicts - priced them again to day. Anything from R22 - R42 ... So I have ++40 in my one tank that means whooo I'm rich - More than R1500 just swimming around .. I'll catch them tonight and deposit them at ABSA in morning ;-), Do you think I should try more than one fish per envelope at the ATM?
     
  9. Slojo

    Slojo

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    Call me ABSA.

    LOL:p

    Can you sex them successfully?
    If so then i would gladly take a male and female off your hands.
    Got a Tank just waiting for them.(Already cycled and decorations put in as well as "breeding pot" and NO PLANTS)
     
  10. Jaguar007

    Jaguar007 Cich'ness

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    Ffw

    Hi All,

    Does Derek only operate from Garden World? Where is his other premises???


    Regards,

    Emil.
     
  11. stormbringer101

    stormbringer101 ARO

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    on a smallholding about a km behind garden world.well worth the visit
     
  12. theosmit

    theosmit

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    Just remember that a breeder breeds. It is not cost efficient for him te spend the time (20mins plus) to sell 4 fish at double their prices. If he does that all day the rest of his work won't get done. He breeds the fish - someone else that is geared for it sells the fish. If he starts selling he will have to gear his setup to accommodate lots of people in and out.
     
  13. Madam

    Madam Kirsty

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    I also visited Derek this weekend, and what a quality guy. I'm going to commission him to make my next tank, and will support his business continually.

    Theosmit, Derek doesn't mind getting people on his farm, but will only give advise to his own clients, for the exact reason that you have stated. Ie: Don't phone him for 20 minutes of advise, unless you intend to do business with him.

    His tanks are BEUATIFUL, top quality, and SO reasonable compared to pet store stuff. I am SOLD.
     
  14. Mongwopman

    Mongwopman King Ding-a-ling

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    Does he have a website?
     
  15. f-fish

    f-fish #unspecified

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    Yes - stale, hacked sooo out dated ..

    I'll PM you - not sure if we are allowed to post url's.

    Proof that he makes good tanks - himself.... not stuck with his nose in a keyboard the whole day.
     
  16. Henk Hugo

    Henk Hugo

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    so why dont you guys get him to become a sponsor
     
  17. OP
    Zoom

    Zoom Retired Moderator

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    To comment on everyone...

    FFW is literally behind garden world. Need to phone to make appointment to see him. He's often not at home, and out doing maintenance on other tanks that he has maintenence contracts on. (Michaelangelo hotel Koi pond... etc)

    His tanks are all custom made by himself. He takes personal pride in all his tanks, and you can definately see the quality in his workmanship.

    Yes.. his website is VERY stale (I think it has stood the same for a year or 2!) He complains that between the breeding/feeding/building tanks and running the small store in Garden World, he doesn't have time to keep the site updated. Pity tho, because there's huge potential in it.

    I don't think he would be interested in sponsoring, as he has his own forum running on his website... but due to the hacking he experienced a while ago, newbies can't join at the moment.

    I'd be interested to see if Nemo's woul be interested in sponsoring
     
  18. Henk Hugo

    Henk Hugo

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    Nemo's will be closed down by legal guys form the film studio pretty quicky
     
  19. Gilbertr14

    Gilbertr14 Phenacogrammus

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    Playing devils advocate here.

    But LFS' do need to cover shrinkage due to losses related to stess etc.
    So at the end, paying 35 - 40 bucks for an Angel is not entirely criminal.
    Anyway, we live in a free market society. Shop around.
    I bought a Tinfoil last week, for 37 rand less than one shop I asked.
     
  20. Sean J

    Sean J

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    Not really... They wont really bother about a pet store called Nemos. As long as it's not called Finding Nemo, they will be fine. The full title of the movie will get them into trouble. What about Captain Nemo? They will be fine with their name. As long as the branding remains different from the Animated Characters, there will be no legal recourse on that.

    My main breeding setup was supplied by Derek. The tanks anyways. I asked him to put glass sliders on each 2ft and 3ft tank and he did!! Brilliant workmanship. Whenever I need new tanks, I speak to Derek. He knows his stuff and is a wealth of information.

    I believe he is actually a member on this forum.
     
  21. SauRoN

    SauRoN

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    People forget that LFS' not only need to pay for shipping costs and such, but also for expensive floorspace in popular areas so as to entice new business.

    If you had to see how much any modern shop pays to rent their space a month, you would soon realise just how much profit they need to charge, just to break even.

    Then you add factors like staff receiving salaries and so on and so on, and the markup is often MORE than justified.
     

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