Lecture 3 - Sumps and How they work

its actually a very bad design - NEVER have a pipe under the water level more than what you want to sump to drain during a power failure.

 

I think what Henk is trying to say is that if you have a pipe at that level in the water, in the event of a power failure, your tank will siphon up until that point....

 

exactly - a breather hole can get blocked and then you have a flood of note

 

Thats what i said good idea just put more thought into the design. Its a massive undertaking and should not be attempted until everything is perfect. So stormer bring future plans here so we can discuss any problems we may see. Rather change a design than flood the house

 

As far as i am concerned. sumps and cannisters are practically the same thing. Main differences being volume. On average a sump will filter 2 to 3 times more than what a cannister can. However if you have the right setup with cannister filter and another filter, be it an internal bio filter or OHF then you should be fairly close to what a sump can do for your tank. Personally I dont like a sump from the maintenance aspect. It takes alot longer to clean than cannisters. I can move my whole cannister and clean it in the yard but a sump would have to be emptied first. Todays technology has brought us cannister that now filter 2000 to 3000L per hour, this should bring on very close to what a sump can filter. Just my opinion based on my experience.

 

Where did you pull these figures from? Thumbsuck?

Average capacity of a canister filter is what 15l? Average sump size is say a tall 3ft ie 90X30X45 which is ~120l. Thats a fair amount more space for filter media when compared to a canister.

Don't confuse pump return rates with filtration capability. Just because a canister can return at 2000 to 3000 litres per hour, doesn't mean it will effectively filter 2000 to 3000 litres

 

Thats the perfect solution to the problem.
Now only have a PH in the sump this will give enough force to move the water to the tank and to move the poop towards the siphon now all you have to do is fine tune 1 ph instead of 3.

This is true as adding a sump effectively adds the sump litres to your entire system.
Examples
70l tank + 8l sump = 78l tank
120l tank + 30l sump = 150l tank
300l tank + 120l sump = 420l tank.

This is how you can easily bulk up your system litres and increase as butcherman said the tanks stability.

 

Yerah agreed, hence why i did sya main difference being volume, obviously i should have said main difference being the volume that a sump can filter, sorry I wasnt clear enough to you or anyone else

 

Thanks guys,I appreciate the help.

 

It can work

Stormer – I like your idea, but like some of the other members said, it will have to be fine tuned to prevent all the water in the tank from draining into the sump, and then causing the sump to overflow. I think it is possible to have the sump return pipe at gravel level, connected to a spray bar, but you will have to install a non-return valve. In the even of a power or pump failure, the non-return valve will prevent a siphon being formed. The outlet from the tank to the sump does not have to be at the gravel level, but can be at the water level of your tank. Most of the detritus will be suspended in the water column due to the current flowing over the gravel, and will find its way to the outlet. The outlet will have to be designed in such a way, that it does not get blocked, causing your tank to overflow from the volume of water in the sump being pumped into the tank. I would use nothing less than a 50mm diameter pipe for the outlet to the sump. The 50mm diameter pipe can take more flow that a 25mm, giving you the option of using a pump with a higher liters per hour rating.

 

The lecture continues - Finally !!!!!!!

A sump is nothing more than an extra water container usually underneath an aquarium where you can place equipment, provide different types of filtration ( mechanical and biological), add top-up water to the tank and perform other maintenance tasks

There is no - one best design of sump - Generally they are designed to suit the owner. Bigger is better, as the sump is a way to add water volume to the tank without the tank taking up more space in your room. It is also a place to put your heaters, pumps etc. which means a better looking tank.

The picture shows a general sump design - water is taken from the main tank, piped into the sump. The water flows in on the "dirty side of the sump, is then forced to flow under the baffle into the next chamber. The water then flows over the next baffle into the "clean" side of the sump, where it is pumped back up to the main tank.

In general, where the water enters the sump, filter wool is placed in this compartment, which is a mechanical filter to take out solids etc. The filter wool also provides a breeding ground for bacteria. The second compartment traditionally has bio-balls as a substrate for bacteria breeding. The final compartment, which should now be clean water, is where top-up water is added, heaters are positioned, Aeration and medicines can be added and is then pumped back to the main tank.
The second picture is a photo of what a sump generally looks like.

In effect the sump is just a larger version of a HOB or Canister filter.

More compartments can be added to do specific functions if required. You could add a compartment in which you grow out plants, which also reuces nitrates at the same time. The combinations are only limited by your imagination.

What are the benefits of having a sump

• It makes an ideal place to put heater(s), and other equipment, because you don't have to figure out ways to hide all this stuff when hung on the outside or placed inside an aquarium, and it saves on space.
• It is an ideal place to put bio-media for biological filtration, as well as perform additional mechanical and chemical filtration.
• It is the perfect place for dosing meds and ferts also topping up tank water.
• It adds beneficial tank water volume to your system.
• It can provide additional aeration to your system.
• It can contribute to improved quality of the aquarium water.
• When set up properly, it can act as a back up water overflow system if the power fails.

What are the drawbacks of having a sump

• Unless you do your water volume calculations correctly it can be a flood hazard in power failures. Do your calcs correctly and this is not a problem.
• If your tank is not drilled an overflow box can be a bit tricky to start and stop after power failures. But there are ways to overcome this.
• It can siphon back through the pump during power failures. Again watch your inlet placement and put a one way valve on the inlet pipe from the pump.

Conclusions


A well designed and thought out sump is a better filter than most, and provides larger water volume which is always a good thing. It is easy to clean and maintain.

 

Good question - I have never had this problem occur, the evaporation is normally taken care of by top-ups.. I have never seen a failed overflow, but it would cause a problem. One way around that is to have the heater below the intake level of the pump...

 

I would be interested with this information as I am new to having a sump tank set-up.

 

Keith the lecture continues in this thread. See post number 34.

 

OR the second, it all depends if there is a opening under the first baffle!
- If the water goes through the first chamber, under the first baffle, and over the second baffle!
All depends how the sump(baffles) are configured.
There's the correct answer! :idea: